Author Topic: AZ2R - Another Zelda 2 Remake  (Read 2272 times)

Shade Aurion

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AZ2R - Another Zelda 2 Remake
« on: December 25, 2017, 08:54:27 am »
Hi guys, so i'm trying to keep this project on the down low a little but its a Remake of Zelda 2. I was going to Rom hack LTTP and got a ways in before I was pointed towards Solarus and working with RPG Maker for years and years, i'm used to editors like this for creating projects and hell, its nice not being bound to LTTP assets only. Aaaaany ways, rather then creating question after question thread I thought I would combine a vague update thread (for the sake of avoiding C&D) with a question thread on Solarus for those that can help me out. I'm not in this for personal glory either. I just want this project done so I can play it myself lol but if anyone wants to collaborate with me and get involved, shoot me a PM. I would like to release in 2019 if not late 2018 which considering the length of Zelda 2, I feel this is a realistic time frame. My personal project i'm working on is vastly bigger and 40% done and i've finished Zelda 2 a load of times, but i'd like to add some additional content yet try and keep it as accurate as possible. The challenge will be in translating a side scrolling game into a top down action adventure but I know what I want this to look like so that shouldn't be a problem. Anyways, suggestions and what not are much appreciated.

So, questions. Does anyone know roughly the overworld map size of LTTP if it were in Solarus? I just need a gauge for comparison. I'll be dividing Project Z2R into 4 Maps, 3 Continents and a Mountain Range. Western Hyrule, Death Mountain, Eastern Hyrule and Maze Island.

So basically if I wanted to make this map (Below) in LTTP or even 4 Swords graphics and elaborate on it, maybe add an extra 25% to the size of the map in border, just in case, What map size would I be looking at? Once I do this map i'm sure I can estimate the others fairly well. I just don't want to invest a bunch of time only to have to edit work possibly erasing some work i've done.



I'm watching all the tutorials but i'll still have a few questions here and there. Mapping I generally excel in and enjoy the most but there is no denying i'm new to Solarus.
« Last Edit: February 02, 2018, 06:39:43 am by Shade Aurion »

Ezka

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Re: Project Z2R
« Reply #1 on: December 26, 2017, 02:55:41 pm »
If the overworld of LTTP was remade in solarus it would be the same as the original game. Im pretty sure that is 4096 pixels by 4096 pixels or 256 by 256 tiles.(16 by 16 tiles)

wrightmat

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Re: Project Z2R
« Reply #2 on: December 26, 2017, 03:43:10 pm »
The full AoL map consists of 169x118 tiles (of course a lot of that is ocean). Although the map from AoL contains the full map for LoZ, so the scale is obviously much larger than LttP.

MetalZelda

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Re: Project Z2R
« Reply #3 on: December 26, 2017, 05:03:54 pm »
The full AoL map consists of 169x118 tiles (of course a lot of that is ocean). Although the map from AoL contains the full map for LoZ, so the scale is obviously much larger than LttP.

There is one missing thing in the AOL map image, the labyrinth before the last palace

For the map size you have 2 solutions

Map the whole map into 1 single huge map (You are prone to lags if you put a lot of entities, rare in Solarus but it can still happen)
"Segment" the maps by linking maps each other

Start with the basic 320x240, then resize the map to your needs, it's fairly easy on Solarus

Shade Aurion

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Re: Project Z2R
« Reply #4 on: December 27, 2017, 05:06:08 am »
Thanks for the replies guys, it means a lot. I've been waiting for some feedback before I get the ball rolling (That and Christmas) After considering the variables I think i'll try the 256x256 of LTTP first and if that doesn't get laggy and feels fluid enough, I might just leave it, but I would be open to a bunch of different maps that aren't square shaped. For example, Walking into Kakariko Village, its fairly large to walk around in much like the desert area in the light world. In that regard, I may split Western Hyrule into 9ish parts. I guess we'll see. I'll have Western Hyrule in one map done for you guys to see in my next post. If it gets laggy, i'll split it into a few areas. I would prefer to theme each palace area also (and the palaces themselves) as opposed to just empty desert or something like that. When I do actually do the first dungeon, i'll likely link it to some side quest. Maybe even have a mini practice dungeon first before sending the player there. I'll need to make some Old Lady Impa sprites too.. She'll need to be a pretty big part of the game. I would like to have a whole lot of option content in the game. I'm thinking a lot of Minish Cap and Ocarina of Time while doing all this. I also want a lot of the NPCs to matter. I'll have fun with Bagu and Error, thats for sure :3

Anyways, i'll stop rambling. I'll have some stuff for you guys to judge and critique soon <3

---

Also, i'm thinking for post game content i'll make an extra continent. Maybe a world between worlds sort of continent with a set of small dungeons and a few towns based on other Nintendo titles. I think it would be fun. I remember back in the day when Link's Awakening dropped I loved all the cameos of stuff like Yoshi's Egg and the Yoshi Doll, Kirby as an Enemy, Chain Chomp as character (even though LTTP straight up has Chain Chomp enemies) and stuff like that. That of course will have to wait til this game is completed. Maybe even become a separate game of its own using Superstar Saga Assets or something. I dunno.

I may need help from some of the better spriters and coders down the line (with full credit of course) but I wouldn't expect anyone to volunteer til they see some substantial work put in first so i'll be working on that ^_^
« Last Edit: December 27, 2017, 12:50:29 pm by Shade Aurion »

Shade Aurion

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Re: Project Z2R
« Reply #5 on: January 03, 2018, 08:31:48 am »
Okay, i've drawn out on paper Rauru, Ruto, the first P Bag, Magic Upgrade, Health Upgrade areas, Parapa Passage, The First Palace, etc and drawn up Western Hyrule and divided it up into 9 parts so I don't face any lag issues. I'll be replacing EXP/P-Bags with Ruppees and Magic/Health Upgrades with Heart Pieces. I'll keep Link Dolls as collectables and shoe horn in some other cool little side quests. I want it to be similar to the original game, but better :3

I guess its time to do all the actual mapping now. I'll tackle it area by area and when this part is done i'll make sure the maps are connected and traversable, items and NPCs are all added before adding in enemies and bosses. This is pretty fun TBH I may have minor issues with sprites later if i'm being reasonable so I might need some input there but the next update will actually have pictures and maybe video so that should be up in a week or so. I'm also playing through Zelda 2 - Rev Edition on DudeGoBack as a refresher for the game so I have a fresh reference point in mind.

Back to tutorials
« Last Edit: January 03, 2018, 08:36:37 am by Shade Aurion »

Shade Aurion

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Re: AZ2R - Another Zelda 2 Remake
« Reply #6 on: February 02, 2018, 07:15:11 am »
Okay, on paper i've mapped out the whole game. I can see the image in my head and now its down to mapping it in Solarus. I've done all the icons and game logos and gathered all the necessary resources (NPC charsets, music, etc)

I've divided up the maps into West Hyrule, East Hyrule, Death Mountain and Maze Island. Each 'screen' is 1024x1024 and there are 15 sections for West and East Hyrule. 6 for Death Mountain and Maze Island. I'll be tweaking things to work a little better with Zelda as a series and tie things up a bit better in general.

For those that don't know, the official story is:

Several years after the events of The Legend of Zelda, the now-sixteen-year-old Link notices a strange mark on the back of his left hand, exactly like the crest of Hyrule. He seeks out Impa, who responds by taking Link to the North Castle, where a door has been magically sealed for generations. Impa places the back of Link's left hand on the door, and it opens, revealing a sleeping maiden. Impa tells Link that the maiden is Zelda (not the Zelda from the first game), the princess of Hyrule from long ago, and the origin of the "Legend of Zelda". Zelda's brother had tried to force her into telling their recently deceased father's secrets concerning the last of three sacred golden triangle treasures of his kingdom, known collectively as the Triforce. Princess Zelda refused to reveal its location, and the prince's wizard friend, in anger, tried to strike her down with a spell. Zelda fell under a powerful sleeping spell, but the wizard was unable to control the wildly arcing magic and was killed by it. The prince, filled with remorse and unable to reverse the spell, had his sister placed in the castle tower, in the hope that she would one day be awakened. He decreed that princesses born to the royal family from that point on would be named Zelda, in remembrance of this tragedy.

Impa says that the mark on Link's hand means that he is the hero chosen to awaken Zelda. She gives Link a chest containing six crystals and ancient writings that only a great future king of Hyrule can read. Link finds that he can read the document, even though he has never seen the language before; it indicates that the crystals must be set into statues within six palaces scattered all over Hyrule. This will open the way to the Great Palace, which contains the Triforce of Courage. Only the power of the combined Triforces can awaken the enchanted Zelda. Taking the crystals, Link sets out to restore them to their palaces. Meanwhile, the followers of Ganon are seeking to kill Link, as sprinkling his blood on Ganon’s ashes will bring Ganon back to life.

Ultimately, Link restores the crystals to the six palaces, defeating a strong guardian within each one to do so, and enters the Great Palace. After venturing deep inside, Link must battle a flying creature known as Thunderbird, followed by a shadowy doppelgänger of himself known as Dark Link. Link then claims the Triforce of Courage and returns to Zelda. The three triangles unite into the collective Triforce, and Link's wish awakens Zelda. The game ends as they (presumably) kiss under a falling curtain.


So I was thinking maybe omit the part about it being a different Zelda (because that's stupid) but I could add an intro to the game, maybe add the Prince (who looks like this - https://vignette.wikia.nocookie.net/zelda/images/9/90/Prince_of_Hyrule.png/revision/latest?cb=20090927233717 ) and Impa (who looks like this - https://vignette4.wikia.nocookie.net/zelda/images/b/b8/Sleeping_Zelda.png/revision/latest?cb=20091012015619 ) with appropriate dialogue regarding the mistake the Prince made, the tragedy that happened and the intent to name all future princesses 'Zelda'.

I could also alter the story that the 'Wizard friend' was actually Agahnim/Shadow of Ganon controlling the Prince for intel on the Triforce and instead of dying, he gets what he wants and rushes off to the Great Palace where he later transforms into Shadow Link and attacks you. Maybe I can make the Shadow of Ganon attempt to control Link the way he did the Prince but have Link resist forcing the Shadow into a mirror where he breaks free as Shadow Link. I feel that would link the game to Zelda 1 and LttP and the series in general. Seeing as Zelda 2 is the end of a potential timeline with no subsequent sequels, I could probably take a few liberties story-wise for the sake of clarity and continuity. Maybe I could mention that the blood of the Hero can be spread over Ganon's ashes to resurrect him too.  Alternatively I could have the Prince at his fathers grave (King's Tomb) and have him do the Aghanim reveal there and just have Impa in the beginning explaining the back story and what Link should be doing as opposed to just being plonked in front of Zelda randomly.

I'll cut out most of the spells and sword techniques and replace them with interchangeable items and stuff. I'll be removing the regular jump (obviously) and maybe instead replace it with a Roc's Feather item later so there are still pitfalls. Maybe replace the Jump Spell with Hookshot instead. Rather then the Fireball Spell, i'll probably just have the Bow. Maybe even get the Bow earlier and later instead of the Fireball Spell, get the Fire Arrows.  Instead of the Reflect Spell I can just have the Mirror Shield. I can keep the Hammer but use it AND Bombs for large boulders, small barriers and walls. Rather then the Shield Spell I can have the red and blue tunics later in the game. Rather then sword techniques I can add the blade beam, spinning technique, extra swords, extra shields, etc I might keep the Fairy Spell and make it an item instead and have it work similar to the Magic Cape. I'd like to have medallions like A Link to the Past but i'd want them to be different and named after the Goddesses themselves.

I dunno, as it is currently i'm mapping the game for now but I have a lot of ideas for mechanics and to make things work in a top down perspective rather then the old side scrolling style. Any help would be appreciated. I'm not much of a sprite artist. I guess I could do that sort of thing if I had to but i'd rather the game have polish. This project could be a big one for Solarus when completed :)

Diarandor

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Re: AZ2R - Another Zelda 2 Remake
« Reply #7 on: February 02, 2018, 08:34:22 am »
Personal request: Why don't you make a new and original Zelda game instead? I, and surely many people, would prefer to play something fresh and full of surprises instead of the same games again and again. It could be a short game and not so ambitious, that would be ok. Besides, if you start with something so huge you may never finish the project.
« Last Edit: February 02, 2018, 08:36:23 am by Diarandor »
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Shade Aurion

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Re: AZ2R - Another Zelda 2 Remake
« Reply #8 on: February 02, 2018, 12:23:59 pm »
Personal request: Why don't you make a new and original Zelda game instead? I, and surely many people, would prefer to play something fresh and full of surprises instead of the same games again and again. It could be a short game and not so ambitious, that would be ok. Besides, if you start with something so huge you may never finish the project.

This is actually not that ambitious a project IMHO. Zelda 2 IS a short game. Zelda 1 is too. Certainly not a long games by any means. I am also making other projects that are 100% original in other programs that are MUCH bigger and roughly 65-70% completed but this for me is a project for learning to use Solarus and using it to make something that desperately needs a remake. I've already mapped it all out on paper so I have roughly 62 world map screens and maybe 50-60 regular sized screens for dungeons and towns. That to me is not so bad, plus i'm passionate about this as it was a game from my youth I played a lot and lets face it, its probably the most hated Zelda game bar Wand of Gamelon and the other CDi Games lol It needs a top down facelift. I know exactly what i'm going to do and I have the vision clear in my head. I mapped out the first 2 palaces on paper and am pretty happy with how they turned out. Plus a buddy of mine on Romhacking.net has already released a hacked version of Zelda 2 that I played through on my Youtube channel which is what gave me the inspiration to do this. This project started as a Link to the Past hack until I got shown Solarus. This is happening for sure. I've got most of the NPCs and Boss Sprite charsets ready to go and sure some need some edits and i'll need to make some from scratch but Solarus cuts out most of what would have been a hurdle in hacking.

I've got the passion. Even if its just one map every other day, it'll get done and I won't release a demo til its complete to avoid getting slapped bit the long dick of Nintendo via DMCA XD

Diarandor

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Re: AZ2R - Another Zelda 2 Remake
« Reply #9 on: February 02, 2018, 01:37:56 pm »
Ok, but make sure that you finish it someday. We can't wait to play new Solarus games! ;D

PS: If you want the new version not to be so hated, my recommendation is to allow saving when Link dies, so that you don't lose the progress (level, items, etc). If I remember correctly, in the original game you couldn't. You could allow choosing 2 modes: "classic mode" (hard) and "easy mode" (the latter one would allow saving progress when Link dies, which is perfect for casual gamers, or bad gamers like me ::)).
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Shade Aurion

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Re: AZ2R - Another Zelda 2 Remake
« Reply #10 on: February 04, 2018, 02:23:38 pm »
Ok, but make sure that you finish it someday. We can't wait to play new Solarus games! ;D

PS: If you want the new version not to be so hated, my recommendation is to allow saving when Link dies, so that you don't lose the progress (level, items, etc). If I remember correctly, in the original game you couldn't. You could allow choosing 2 modes: "classic mode" (hard) and "easy mode" (the latter one would allow saving progress when Link dies, which is perfect for casual gamers, or bad gamers like me ::)).

Oh absolutely and I totally appreciate the caution from you man. I've seen so many projects slow to a crawl and eventually die and its why i'm just doing it. I'm something of a RMVXA/MV Veteran and i'm capable with Game Maker Studio. Solarus for the most part is very easy to pick up. I'm mainly only worried about unpolished mapping and Boss AI. And absolutely dude, i'll be making this project as similar to ALttP/MC as possible. I love the idea of a hard mode though. Maybe 3 lives before a special laughing Ganon screen. I'm toying with the idea of a True ending and some post game content too. I'm just trying to map as much as I can. I'm just still getting used to the center top down perspective.
Thanks for all your work also, i'm looking into it and i'll likely do Let's Plays of your projects at some point too just to give props. I was looking through a lot of you and MetalZelda's scripts the other night and you guys have some stellar work. A lot of things i've worried about you've already covered. I'm more used to Ruby3 coding and am new to C++ so learning a new engine with Solarus and how to work things will be a slow process but I won't give up on this. I'll probably play through other well known Solarus projects and give nods to them from NPCs as the NPCs in original AoL's NPCs were pretty one dimensional. I've been helping out Revility with his AoL - Rev Edition patch to make the original game better and it just keeps filling me with ideas and how to improve. I feel i'll be an active member of these forums this year if for nothing else but to beg for help on odd and obscure issues XD

Shade Aurion

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Re: AZ2R - Another Zelda 2 Remake
« Reply #11 on: February 05, 2018, 05:15:59 pm »
Okay, i've gotten the hang of things a lot more and thought i'd show some progress (below) This is still unfinished. I'll be removing the tents and adding 2 more houses and much more detail. I might add the cloud overlay too but this is essentially the second town 'Ruto' in the top left corner of the map I shared earlier. I'll be tackling it segment by segment and adding a bit more direction in general. To access Parapa Cave i'll make it so you need to visit Ruto's Town Elder who will help you after you retrieve the Trophy which I might change to a statue or an idol or something. The first shop I think i'll put in Saria Town and I am toying with the idea of having the weather vanes as transport points once you get the Ocarina and maybe put the weather vanes every second or third town. Also instead of having an old lady who heals your magic and a woman in a dress heal your health, i'll make Bars heal your magic and Inns heal your health. As a throwback I might magic the old woman manage the Inn and the lady in a dress manage the bar. I dunno, it's coming together. I had a play around with XD/XD2, RotH and DX too and there's a lot of inspiration there. A lot i'd like to do similar yet different. All great games :)


Also I might redo the Icon set, but i'm pretty happy with the Logo itself


-----------------------------------------------------------

[EDIT]


Okay, made a lot more progress on Ruto (Above) and only really need to do the NPCs now, but i'l leave that til i've completed the Western Continent. Graves have bones in them and holes to fall into, a bush has a hole you can fall into and all bushes are destructible. I actually redid a lot of the map to make it look a little more aesthetically pleasing. I dunno, i'm pretty happy with how it turned out. Looks better then it did on paper haha Error lives in the purple house ;)


I got all the basics done with the next map. It's the Desert Cave containing the Trophy item. I'll likely have it locked behind a door that the Ruto Elder gives you the key to so people can't break the quest line. I want to keep some open world but I don't want people to break the game. Either. Below this screen is Hyrule Castle and the next screen i'm doing will contain the first Palace. 3 more Maps and North Western Hyrule will be complete :3
« Last Edit: February 06, 2018, 10:17:56 am by Shade Aurion »

Diarandor

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Re: AZ2R - Another Zelda 2 Remake
« Reply #12 on: February 06, 2018, 10:48:24 am »
Wow! This looks amazing. I thought you were coding it as a platformer, like the original game. But this remake seems completely different and awesome!
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wrightmat

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Re: AZ2R - Another Zelda 2 Remake
« Reply #13 on: February 06, 2018, 03:01:14 pm »
Agreed. I love the visual style of Ruto - I think it's perfect. Your attention to detail really brings it all together! In the second map, the bushes seem a little light - is that intentional? Also I'm not sure the tree on the bottom matches the style of the rest - maybe just adjust the colors a bit?

Shade Aurion

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Re: AZ2R - Another Zelda 2 Remake
« Reply #14 on: February 06, 2018, 05:08:33 pm »
Wow! This looks amazing. I thought you were coding it as a platformer, like the original game. But this remake seems completely different and awesome!
Thanks! Yeah no way. Thats what everyone hated about 2. I kinda have respect for 2 as it was pretty much where the sword techniques and magic began but I think it would have worked better as a similar game to ALttP as I feel thats where Nintendo perfected the formula. I tell you what though.. As I learn more about Solarus and how to use it, I find myself infinitely going back and redoing this XD So frustrating but necessary haha I'll probably use a few of your scripts TBH because i'm a bit clueless with the engine. I have loads of experience mapping though. Literally like.. a decade lol

Agreed. I love the visual style of Ruto - I think it's perfect. Your attention to detail really brings it all together! In the second map, the bushes seem a little light - is that intentional? Also I'm not sure the tree on the bottom matches the style of the rest - maybe just adjust the colors a bit?

Thanks man. The second map is just basic atm. I still have a lot of details to add. As for the share of the bushes, do you mean the destructible ones? If so I only have 3 shades to work with unfortunately. If you're talking about that one bush in the center down the bottom, its supposed to look off as its a holy witha heart piece in it :D This is actually an odd section to map because the road is essentially the divider between straight up desert and lush forest lol I'll likely tear it apart and rebuild a heap of it. I'll def reduce the amount of cacti and add in some enemies. Seems like a perfect place to put some Lever enemies and a few Bits and Bots :3

I'll likely have an updated version of the second map and the rough version of the next in a few days  ;D

[EDIT]
Well, the second map is mostly done. I just need to place enemies and tweak a few things
« Last Edit: February 10, 2018, 03:23:18 pm by Shade Aurion »